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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  April 15, 2013 8:00pm-9:00pm PDT

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♪ thanks to you at being with us tonight here on msnbc. i'm rachel maddow. the show is coming to you live from outside massachusetts general hospital in boston where we continue our coverage of the bombing attack that ripped through this city. just before 3:00 this afternoon. today is patriots day which is a holiday here in my home state of massachusetts. it's the day that tens of thousands, no, hundreds of thousands of people pour into the city to run in the boston marathon and to cheer on their friends and loved ones who are running the marathon. three people were killed today in those two explosions that were apparently timed to go off at the finish line of the marathon. among the three people dead is a child. an 8-year-old boy. more than 130 people have been injured. as i said, we're at
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massachusetts general hospital tonight where within the last hour trauma surgeons presiovide some details of the injured people who he has treated over the course of the day. >> there's a variety of injuries, probably the most common serious injuries are combined lower extremity injuries, combined meaning bone injuries, soft tissue injuries and vascular injuries to the lower extremities. we're seeing a lot of shrapnel injuries. many of those involve, again, predominantly the lower extremities. a lot of small metal debris. some people have asked already about whether these were bbs or parts of bombs. i just don't think we're able to say whether these are small bits of metal that were placed there intentionally or part of the environment. >> trauma surgeon explaining that there have been doctors in surgery since early this morning. he's been in surgery since 8:00 this morning. he's performed several surgeries on the injured victims of today's bombings. the bombings took place at approximately 2:50 p.m. local
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time. the trauma surgeon reporting one of his medical partners here at massachusetts general has military experience and has served in both iraq and afghanistan. the doctor describing that experience, that wartime experience as being apparently very useful today. as doctors treated some of the more than 130 people who were injured. there are many, many unanswered questions tonight. including unconfirmed reports about other potentially explosive devices. found on or near the scene of the bombings today. law enforcement officials have not confirmed that there were other unexploded bombs for lack of a less specific but more politic term. as of tonight the official confirmation is that there were two devices. only two. those were the two that caused the massive explosions. to the extent that there were other devices today, isolated and treated in some way by law enforcement, those may have been devices that were investigated as suspect packages, as potential bombs and done away with by law enforcement in the
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sometimes explosive way they do that. there are no suspects as of this evening. no arrests have been made. the investigation is now being headed by the fbi in conjunction with other federal and state and local agencies. i want to bring in now a young man today who is an eyewitness to what happened today. jared walker. he was eating with co-workers from ibm at a restaurant a football field's length of way when he heard the first explosion. thanks for being here. you're 100 yards away. what was it like watching? >> we were inside the restaurant, heard the first explosion. kind of shook the building a little bit. we kind of wondered what it was. looked outside and saw some smoke and actually ran outside. then the second one blew up about 100 yards from us like, right there in front of us. >> did they sound like they were about the same size? >> the first one it sounded small because it was farther down street. i didn't realize until i actually watched the footage when i got home, you know, they were basically the same size.
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i saw it. you know, ran back into the restaurant and i fotold everyona bomb went off. some people were in shock. they thought i was joking. some people thought it was a sewage pipe bursting or something. >> manhole or something. >> yeah. we kind of stood there. i was telling everybody to get out, run, you know. we didn't really know what to do. i went to twitter to see if there was any news. it was the only thing i could think of. >> yeah. >> there was nothing on twitter yet. you know, it just happened. i tweeted out that, you know, i think a bomb just went off here at the finish line. and about that time, it started to get chaotic. you know, just cops telling us to run. so at the restaurant, emptying out, we're running down the streets like a scene from a movie or something you see on the news. >> you know where you were running to or trying to get away from the area? >> no, it was absolute across. masses of people running down the street. we kept running. they were, you know, directing us all the way -- i mean, we
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started out in front of the prudential center and ended up out in fenway. all the -- there was runners still running by. i didn't even realize that was going on. nobody was stopping them really. that was the -- that was a crazy part because they had the headphones in, whatever, so. >> one of the things that, unfortunately, in coordinated attacks, one of the aspects of terror that people experience in being around those attacks is that there are multiple occasions. you saw it was not one event. it was two events. so presumably you're afraid at that point there's going to be a third? >> yeah, that was the craziest thing, right, is you don't really know we're safe, you know, where it is to go. i didn't know if i should stay in the restaurant, we should go outside, run. you know, we were running into masses of people. you just didn't know if another explosion was going to occur. you know, it was just the unknown which is -- that's the scariest feeling i ever had. you know, you feel like you're so close to death there. you know? just wanted to run home and kiss my wife at that point, you know,
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just insane. >> and at that point, no police officers or anybody on scene is able to tell you which way to go. >> all they're saying is run. you know, that -- i mean, they're feeling the same things we were at that point. they didn't know what was going on, you know? it was just chaos. >> nobody in peacetime situations in the united states ever has a police officer just tell them, run. >> yeah. exactly. >> it's not a good sign. jared, thank you so much for being able to tell us what you did. >> appreciate it. thank you. >> appreciate it. jared walker. again, eyewitness today. he was about 100 yards from where those bombs went off. there were so many eyewitnesss today because these bombs went off in such a crowded area. at the finish line of the boston marathon, it's obviously the most crowded of anywhere. people line that route throughout. throughout its 26-mile path. that's part of why it's such a big deal in boston and why it's held on patriots day because of the mass of humanity that's
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brought out to celebrate and cheer on this historic marathon in this city. it's part of the reason i think it's so jarring to bostonians because it's the opposite of the way we think of this day. bombs, einsin area devices, hav been used as weapons before h this country. they're sometimes deadly, not always, sometimes. they're always disorienting and terri terrifying. and over time, when you look at these incidents, when you look at different bombings in american history that have been done by different people for different reasons, to different effe effect, one of the things that happens, and pretty much every time, it can take a long time to figure out what exactly happened. how many people were killed and hurt and who was responsible. the last 20 years, consider these bombings on u.s. soil. 1993, the first attack on the world trade center. the truck bomb packed with explosives tore apart the underground parking area of the north tower in the world trade center. in that bombing, six people were
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killed. more than 1,000 people were injured. the investigating team was huge. 700 fbi agents from all around the world investigating the first world trade center bombing. it was two weeks before the first suspect was arrested. mastermind of the bombing was arrested two years later in pakistan. 1994, man we call the unabomber, sent an explosion in the mail. the explosion when that piece of mail was open killed a new jersey man. the unabomber had been sending these for 15 years by the time that happened. 1995 the oklahoma city bombing in oklahoma city. a truck bomb filled with explosives killed 168 people. injured hundreds of people. the oklahoma city bombing was on the anniversary of the raid on the branch dividian compound in waco, texas. the agency had offices in the
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oklahoma city building. and at first, after the oklahoma city bomb, there was speculation there maybe was some direct connection between those two even events, maybe it had been branch dividian survivors who carried out that bombing. that was not correct. fbi agents search eed furiously for a suspect, the guy responsible for that attack, timothy mcveigh, was sitting in a jail cell. he left the scene of the i attack, pulled over by a police officer because the vehicle he was driving was missing a license's plate. police officer arrested him for carrying a concealed weapon and ultimately the fbi arrested him for killing 168 people in the federal building explosion. 1995 the unabomber struck again, killed a man in sacramento, california. it was another year before the fbi finally arrested ted kosinski in a cabin in rural montana. it took two decades for investigators to identify and catch the unabomber.
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1996, summer olympic games in atlanta. three pipe bombs packed with nails in them put under a bench at centennial olympic park. a security guard at the park saw the bag and started clearing the area when the bomb went off. a woman was killed by -- one woman was killed by the bomb. a man had a heart attack as a result of it. more than 100 people were wounded. the security guard in that case, richard jewel trying to clear the area, went from hero to suspect, and became suspected in that crime although he was never actually charged with it. he was a subject of widespread public speculation and suspicion before he was cleared officially of wrongdoing in that attack. 1998, bombing at an abortion clinic which killed one person and seriously wounded another. security officials used a robot to search for a second bomb there. they thought there might be one. there wasn't one. they thought the bombing might be connected to other attacks in atlanta. in that case they were right.
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five years after the bombing of an abortion clinic, an antiabortion extremist was arrested for attacking the abortion clinic and for the bombing at the olympic games that had been wrongly blamed on the security guard. eric rudolph pleaded guilty to those crimes. to those bombings. in 2000, an arson attack at a temple in syracuse, new york, caused $700,000 in damage. a naturalized u.s. citizen was charged with the crime and found guilty. in 2002, somebody planted 18 pipe bombs in mailboxes in five states over the course of a single weekend. six people were injured. it's amazing that no one was killed. police had no idea who the serial pipe bomb planter was until a man from wisconsin called to say he thought maybe his own son was the culprit. his 21-year-old son was arrested and admitted to planting all of those bombs. 2008, somebody placed a bomb in front of a military recruiting office in times square in new york city. it went off in the middle of the night. thankfully nobody was injured. security tapes showed a man on a bicycle near the scene, but
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nobody was ever charged with a crime. also in 2008, an explosion at a federal courthouse in san diego, california. nobody was injured which, again, felt like a miracle. it was two pounds of explosives and three galvanized steel pipes with over 100 roofing nails packed in to cause maximum damage. took agents from the atf, fbi, joint terrorism task force and district attorney's office locally to finally solve the crime. a man with money problems convinced two women to set the bomb so he could turn them in and collect the reward money. instead he ended up sentenced to 55 years in prison. 2008, two biologists at uc santa cruz were attacked with fire bombs outside their homes. the fbi took over the case, treated it like domestic terrorism. nobody's ever been charged for those attacks. 2011, at a martin luther king jr. day parade, city workers in spokane, washington, found a backpack stuffed with explosives packed with fishing weights. luckily that explosive did not go off. the fbi were able to track the fishing weights which led them to a committed white
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supremacist. they charged him and he was found guilty of planting the bomb and sentenced to more than 30 years in prison. those are just some of the attacks by explosive device that we have seen here in the united states in the last 20 years. some of the more ignorant commentary over the course of the day asserted nothing like this has ever happened in the united states. certainly nothing like this has ever happened at the boston marathon. nothing like this has ever happened at the finish line of the boston marathon on pate rri day in washington. it's not like we have no experience of people setting off bombs to instill terror in us all. what we can learn from looking back at the pattern, sometimes it takes a while to figure out who it is. over these incidents in last 20 years, in most of them it took time. it took some time before anybody, before you or me or the fbi or somebody tweeting to you knew exactly what had happened. let alone who had done it and why. i want to bring into the conversation now once again michael lighter, an msnbc and nbc news national security analyst.
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former director of the national counterterrorism center. thank you very much for being with us again. i appreciate your time. >> good to be back with you, rachel. >> in terms of what we know, now, we are now hearing from law enforcement sources that the only two confirmed exploes plop devices are those that exploded, other packages that may have been detonated or exploded or done away with by law enforcement today may have been things they were investigating as potential suspect devices. does that change anything in terms of potential leads or what you think the scale of the investigation might be? >> i think it changes my view of the attacks a little bit. although i have to say i'm not surprised initial information has proven to be wrong. that happened every time in these investigations, whether it was how many people were injured, how many weapons, what kind of weapons. first reports are always wrong in the confusion. and we say more bombs, more
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weapons, would, i think, pretty clearly indicate greater sophistication. but i think as you just suggested in your piece, we have to be so careful about drawing conclusions too early on. so frankly, fewer bombs means probably less sophistication. but that doesn't tell me as a counterterrorism professional whether this is domestic terrorism like timothy mcveigh, whether or not it's a unabomber or whether or not it's islamic international terrorism. >> governor patrick, governor deval patrick here is taking care to describe the location of the bombing. the boylston street area. that whole area around the finish line of the marathon as an active crime scene. in a technical sense, does that mean that it's still a place in which they are collecting evidence and so essentially has to be sealed from any outside contamination? >> they'll do their best. i mean, i think a large area there is sealed, and certainly the area around the street and the route is going to be very,
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very carefully examined for forensic evidence by both the boston police department and the fbi. now that's, of course, potentially important to a future prosecution, but right now much more importantly, it's important that evidence is not contaminated so you can do good forensic analysis and try to track it back in a way that you can identify who did this, where it came from, what sorts of materials were used, whether or not there's a certain signature associated with these bombs that the fbi or alcohol, tobacco, firearms and explosives, atfe, has seen in the past. so, you know, it's an enormous area that they have to cordon off, and they will probably need to have it closed for a period of 12, 24, 36 hours to do this sort of investigation. >> mr. leiter, was listening for a time today to the boston emergency police scanner, which is the publicly accessible scanner that anybody can listen in on if you bother fenagling
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with it for enough time. hearing the calls from off duty police officers to please report to their district, essentially all hands on deck, if you're involved with public safety at all in the boston area, everybody is at work, everybody is on this. in that kind of an environment with a large city like this, large police department, obviously the first responders on the scene are race volunteers. runners, themselves. passersby. and, of course, boston police officers and firefighters and emts. how does it work practically to have the fbi in charge? the fbi is coordinating this investigation. what does that mean in practical terms when they're dealing with such a large local set of resources? >> well, first of all, this situation, although new in being a real attack, is not new to the city of boston, the state of massachusetts and the federal authorities up there. back in 2011, just over 2 years ago and previously before that, the federal government in conjunction with boston did
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exercises exactly to prepare for situations like this. so what you have is the immediate response is always going to be governed by the boston police department and fire department. the people who are on the scene and have many officials there to respond. and then over time, there will be a transition to the fbi. most importantly, this has to be done hand-in-hand. the state, local and federal cooperation, this isn't honestly like the movies where the fbi shows up and says, we're in charge now. the relationship between the fbi and state and local authorities in these situations is so much more advanced than it was. and having worked with commissioner ed davis and the fbi for many years, this is a team that's going to work well together. and i'm really confident that people shouldn't expect fights and turf battles. people understand this is a time where everybody works together. the fbi will now lead, but the fbi will lean on every federal
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agency and state and local authorities to collect the information necessary to track these guys down. >> in terms of how this happened today, obviously what everybody wants to know is who's responsible and how they're going to be brought to justice. but in terms of terrorism or even crime as an ongoing threat, in large-scale security environments like this, do you feel like we are actually better now at protecting large-scale security events like boston marathon? or like other sort of large-scale events that happen in other major cities than we were before 9/11? it's worrying to see something like this happen when we think we have been made so much safer, when we feel like we've at least been inconvenienced a lot more than we used to be. we're told security is so much tighter. how can something like this happen in an environment that's this secure and do you feel like we've made a lot of progress? >> rachel, that is a great question. and the answer is, although i
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still believe despite this awful tragedy, where at least three have been killed, that with are much, much safer. but what we've safer from is the risk of a catastrophic attack. we are never going to prevent these types of events. we hope that the intelligence will help us disrupt it before it happens like past plots against the new york city subway system. we hope that as an explosion or an attack begins someone might be able to disrupt it as we saw in times square. and, unfortunately, some of these are going to get through, and then what we hope and what we prepare for is a better response to reduce the casualties. we have to think of this as a set of multilayered defenses. and because we have an attack on like this, does not mean that we're not safe. it means that we are going to live for the foreseeable future with a threat of terrorism. whether it is domestic or international or something in between. and we can't take from this that we're not safe. what we should take from this is
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we have to defend against these things. reduce the likelihood of the big, big-scale attacks. and then be really resilient. and we've heard that from people, first responders and bystanders about how they're not going to let them affect their lives. this is a tragedy. but we shouldn't take this as the system has failed, we're not safer. we are. but things are still going to get through and we're going to have tragedies like twe saw today. >> one of the things, one of the only ways we as civilians can help frustrate the aims of people who do things like this is to show how resilient we are and this won't change our lives in fundamental ways. that we'll press on. michael leiter, former director of national counterterrorism center. good to have you here. thank you, sir. >> thank you, rachel. >> i want to tell you the fbi has set up a phone number for anybody to call with information on today's attack. they are describing their call for tips in terms of people who may know anything about what happened in boston today.
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in terms of no information being too insignificant. no potential lead being too small. if you do have information that you think might be of help in the investigation into what happened today in boston, the number to call is easy to remember. it's 1-800-call-fbi. 1-800-call-fbi. which translates to 1-800-225-5324. all right. we are live at mass general hospital in boston. stay with us here on msnbc. we'll be right back. [ coughs ]
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earlier today i was briefed by my homeland security team on the events in boston. we're continuing to monitor and
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respond to the situation as it unfolds. and i've directed the full resources of the federal government to help state and local authorities protect our people, increase security around the united states as necessary, and investigate what happened. i've spoken to fib director muller and secretary of homeland security no paapolitanapolitano. they're utilizing the appropriate resources to investigate and to respond. i've updated leaders of congress in both parties. we reaffirmed on days like this there are no republicans or democrats. we are americans united in concern for our fellow citizens. i've also spoken with governor patrick and mayor menino and made it clear they have every single federal resource necessary to care for the victims and counsel the families. and above all, i made clear to them that all americans stand with the people of boston. we still do not know who did this or why. and people shouldn't jump to conclusions before we have all the facts.
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but make no mistake, we will get to the bottom of this. and we will find out who did this. we'll find out why they did this. any responsible individuals, any responsible groups, will feel the full weight of justice. >> president obama speaking earlier today after being briefed on the bomb blasts that killed three people near the finish line of the boston marathon and that injured well over 100 more. many of those injuriy iey ies g. kristen welker joins us now. what is the white house saying at this hour? what are you hearing from the top? >> reporter: good evening, rachel. senior administration officials tell me president obama will continue to be briefed on this situation throughout the evening. right now, the white house is approaching this as an act of terror. i can read you the latest statement that we have from a senior administration official, rachel. i believe we have a graphic of that as well. this is according to an official who says, "any event with multiple explosive devices as
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this appears to be is clearly an act of terror and will be approached as an act of terror. however, we don't yet know who carried out this attack and a thorough investigation will have to determine whether it was planned and carried out by a terrorist group, foreign or domestic." now, i can tell you, rachel, that is really the key question here tonight. was this carried out by a terrorist group homegrown, or a foreign terrorist group? and, rachel, the white house just simply does not know. i've heard you sort of discussing this as well. there's still a lot of questions about who is responsible for what happened today in boston. the president was made aware of the events at about 3:00 this afternoon. he was briefed on this situation. as he pointed out in his remarks, he did make phone calls to mayor tom menino as well as governor deval patrick. i have been here really all afternoon. i can tell you moments after those blasts went off in boston, pennsylvania avenue outside of the white house was shutdown. closed to foot traffic.
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it is normally closed to cars, to vehicles. but today it was closed to foot traffic done out of an abundance of caution. we should make that very clear. that is something that is sort of par for the course when there has been a breach of security in another state. that is something we would expect. i can tell you, rachel, at this hour, pennsylvania avenue is still closed down to foot traffic outside of the white house. and, again, president obama continues to monitor this situation. we expect him to receive briefs throughout the evening. rachel? >> kristen welker, thank you very much. nbc news white house correspondent. great to have that perspective. i want to bring in now from boylston street in boston, nbc's carey saunders who's out there in the cold. i understand police are still on the scene right now. what can you tell us about what things look like right there right now? >> reporter: well, it is is pretty much shut down. it will continue to be that way through into tomorrow. the reason that is, the authorities are treating this
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vast area as a crime scene. it's possible there may be a clue that is not quite obvious in the daylight, perhaps it will reveal itself. and so most of the access in and out is going to be restricted. there's a tremendous presence of police officers here. the boston police department is on alpha bravo shifts. that means officers are on 12 hours. when they go off, officers come on for another 12 hours and they're going to continue that for the nikts cext couple of da. the focus here is to find a suspect or suspects. ed davis, the police commissioner says anybody who believes there's a suspect is at bring hampton women's is incorrect. if he was pressed by reporters if there was, quote, a person of interest, he didn't respond to that. fine line between person of interest and a suspect. bottom line is everybody has the same question. who is or who are responsible for this? and followed by the question, why? tomorrow will be a difficult day in the city. as much as the city will attempt to operate, things will move much slower, especially public
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transportation. the "t" here which is the transportation system, the green line that runs on the surface, the other line, some underground, the oldest subway system in the nation, it is going to move slowly. officer are going to check backpacks. this is a city with a lot of universities. a lot of people carrying pack packs. all after that is going to move slowly especially now they know the bombs that were detonated had shrapnel inside. that is what caused so much of the damage here. shrapnel are like little ball bearings or bbs that fly out in an explosion and hit people flying in different directions. very painful and in this case also deadly. what will happen for the police, well, the police have on their front several approaches. first of all, as we mentioned, looking for details. perhaps some piece of evidence that will reveal itself tomorrow. but they're also working their intelligence network and that means that if it is a group of people, likely, somebody is going to say something to
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someone and it will maybe even be revealed overnight. and police will move in. but if it's a single person here, just one person who is responsible, it could be that much more difficult. that's why they're asking members of the public who may have an idea, may have a suggestion, may have not so much a theory but just somebody that something doesn't sit right, they want that information brought to the police department. they're also asking people to provide information to the fbi as well as to the police department. any video, any pictures. things that you look at that you maybe took and say, well, that doesn't seem like it's important may now be, indeed, important. so there's a whole team of a task force that will be going through looking at those pictures that are brought in. even it may be a picture that was taken hours before the race. hours before the explosion. something there may be useful. so the authorities are urging people to please provide that information. and of course as you know, rachel, as all of that comes in, it's a mountain to get through.
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but they have a team here. they have folks from the fbi. alcohol, tobacco, tireafirearms just about every agency in the state contributing what they can to see if they can solve why this happened and who's responsible. rachel? >> nbc's kerry sanders, thank you very much for appreciate you being out there in the cold for us and keeping us apprised. you know, it is remarkable, the one thing that has changed over the past decade is the word from law enforcement when incidents like this happen. it used to be about leaving the police to do their job. more and more, you essentially hear police, fbi, law enforcement of all kinds saying, give us everything you've got. tell us everything you know. don't self-censor. if you think you might have something, even if you don't know that it's directly material, but you think it could be, tell us, we'd rather have it than not have it. we have more faith in our data mining abilities than we used to. intelligence-based law enforcement apparatus in this country. we want it if you've got it.
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seeing that shape, seeing that change over time gives you some sense of the way we've evolved in terms of both law enforcement and counterterrorism. both at the international level autoal but responding and being resilient once it happens. peter krauss. thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> based on what we though thus far, what are you most curious about, watching for most in temples of figuring out whether this might be ascribeable to terrorist groups we know of? >> the number of bombings going off in close proximity, time-wise, signature from possible planning from lone wolf individuals or perhaps an organization. so you want to look for that. you want to look for claiming. as far as i know no group claimed the attack yet. sometimes we see that early on. we haven't seen that here. you want to look to some degree, whether you have video there. on one hand this was a good attack for these people in a sense this is a public event, it's a soft target.
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on the other hand, we have live video streaming of when the bombings occurred. there's a good chance we might have a video of suspect, other individuals involved. also as you said, people calling in tips, et cetera, would be very helpful in. >> terms of claims of responsibility, there's being nothing characterized as credible. i know we've heard on nbc there's been some noise in internet chat rooms of people claiming responsibility but nothing anybody is taking all that seriously. i wonder about what we are table to tell from the size and sophistication of the bombs. >> yeah. >> is bomb-making capacity, bomb-making technique now so democratized that a bomb like this doesn't lead you toward a specific group of experts that can do it because almost anybody can do a bomb like this? >> it's scary to say. if it's a type of pipe bomb with low-grade explosive, that's been demom tized for a while. if this is a plastic explosive, it's harder to get your hands on. if it's a pipe bomb, directions for this are on the internet. materials are available. the issue is if this is a lone
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wolf individual, someone who's motivated but not necessarily trained, again and again we see 100 people who can't shoot straight for one timothy mcveigh or one nidal malik hassan. though it seems like gettinging a is ses to a gun or bombs is very easy, why don't we see more of these if we have motivated individuals? it's scary, people do have access to tease weapons. i don't think because of the bomb, itself, it's this type of group or this type of individual. honestly i think the weapon, itself, is not so sophisticated. that makes the net quite wide in terms of who's a potential suspect. >> in terms of boston's resilience, a big part is how boston bounces back. >> yeah. >> do we know anything about how good a counterterrorism operation boston law enforcement is? >> well, i think we're probably finding out right now to some degree. thankfully, boston, it's a place where some of the 9/11 hijackers came from. in terms of actual attacks in the city, there have been a number of false starts or things where they thought it was, then it wasn't. we haven't had something of this
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magnitude i can remember since i've been here. i've been here ten years. i guess i would say this. on the one hand as i say, this is a target that makes a lot of sense for someone trying to get notoriety or their name out there. one of the biggest things you were talking about this before in terms of what makes an attack a tactical success but a strategic success, making a political impact. i'm not sure the targets could have picked a worse target. the marathon, you see people running, cheers for people regardless of their ethnicity, all over the world. this is an international event. what's going to happen this time next year? hopefully more runners, more spectators than ever before. memorializing the people who, you know, died here today as well as the first responders who made sure that we only, at this point, a couple people killed despite many, many more wounded. that goes to the fact there was such quick reaction time. in many ways in terms of whether this can have a political impact, i think you couldn't really have picked a worst target in terms of actually scaring people which is off how terrorism is effective. people come back with resilience, unity, showing we're not going to be hurt by this,
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it's often ineffective. in many ways they made a mistake here. >> i felt exactly that way when i heard the news today that the london marathon, in a few days is going ahead as scheduled. with resilience in its mind. peter krause, assistant professor of political science at boston college. thank you for being here. i'm going to get you a scarf in a moment. more of our coverage of today's bombings at the boston marathon when we come back. [ female announcer ] your smile.
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we were at the lennox hotel which is right at the corner of boylst boylston and exiter, a half block from where the bombs exploded. we were waiting for my friend who ran the marathon to meet up with us. me and a girl friend were having lunch. at 2:50 this massive explosion occurs. we could feel the ground shake below us and everything on our table shook. ten seconds later a second blast hit and we looked outside and saw a plume of smoke up in the air. we saw the building across from the spectator stands which was a mirrored tall office building shakes. and that's when panic struck everyone in that restaurant. >> that was alicia layne from knbc in los angeles who was in town here in boston to cheer on a friend running the marathon today. the investigation began today
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almost immediately. federal agents joining local law enforcement in trying to fig wrur out what happened and who did this. earlier tonight, not long ago here outside mass general i spoke with congressman bill keating. congressman keating represents the suburb south of boston. he's also a member of the house homeland security committee. he's also a former district attorney in massachusetts which gives him a good perspective on what happened here today. you are a new congressman. you are not new to massachusetts politics and to public service. and am i right that you serve on the homeland security committee? >> that's correct. >> can you shed any light from your perspective as somebody on the homeland security committee in terms of how this incident should be characterized, how we should be thinking about this investigation going forward? >> it's hard to separate yourself out from being someone that's represented boston before and being here. the city is just has a somberness tonight that i can't remember in a long time. so i'll try to do that as all of
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us are looking at the family members of now three people that have lost their lives. and i think the number's even at 120 now in the number of people that were injured. and you just try and make sense out of something that makes no sense in terms of what appears to be a terrorist action. and we don't know. i mean, from a homeland security perspective, you look at the symbols, because that's what terrorists try to attack. that's their targets. and here we had the marathon, which is the oldest in the country and one of the largest in the world. it's an international event attracting almost 100 countries that have runners here. it's that kind of symbol a terrorist would look at and also it's tax day. it's april 15th. and if it's a domestic type of terrorist that hates their government and wants to rebel against it, that's also a symbol as well. i think that we'll follow the evidence the way law enforcement people do. being a former d.a., that's --
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you only know what you know. and they're sorting those things out. i can tell you this, that the fusion center here, where the federal law enforcement people work with the state law enforcement people, and the local is one of the finest in the whole country. it's rated that way. so there's no question in my mind that that group added the assets of the entire country right now, that the president is calling on, will bring the person responsible to justice. it's that level of confidence right now. but it's hard to even go there when you're sitting there, you know, people that you know, people that know other people, have been injured in this, and this terrible incident, three have already lost their lives. >> yeah. >> it's hard to get past that now, but the professionals that are doing this are doing that. and they will bring that person to justice. >> it is -- one of the reasons i wanted to get specific about the details we have from the hospitals is because while this targeted apparently the finish
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line or near the finish line of the marathon, it really did target the bystanders which may explain why we have so many children among those injured. you don't have 2-year-olds running the marathon. they're there as babes in arms with family members watching this joyous event. >> usually with family members in the race. so many of those family members are those running for charity, a family member with cancer or an ailment and running to raise money for that. their children and loved ones are sitting there the at the finish line to embrace them after an enormous commitment of time. so -- >> in terms of -- >> it's awful. >> in terms of the type of attack this is, one of the things that's broken late this evening, it seems to have been, there's reportedly a number of unexploded devices recovered after the event. we don't have exactly all of the details or the locations yet. they're telling us to proceed with caution in terms of the way we understand the character of the attack and how many different events might have been planned in addition to the two explosions that happened.
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>> there are sources that we've had that have told us that there are at least two other bombs that weren't detonated as well. so you can look at the brighter side of it, say, it could have been worse without the medical hospitals that we have so clear. without the triaging that's there for the marathon anyway. it's small solace to those people that have lost their loved ones and, you know, the people that have been injured. but this could have been worse. >> as a former d.a., though, one of the things that occurs to me about having unexploded devices in custody is that's very valuable evidence in terms of tracking the types of devices these were. and in terms of giving you leads for investigative -- >> it is. >> -- process. >> the devices that have exploded, they're very valuable, too, in terms of evidence. so that kind of forensic evidence, we're bringing the best people in the country to boston. we have some of the best to
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begin with. they're bringing in people from the fbi, from new york, and other areas that are specially trained on that. this is an amazing country. and as much as we feel, you know, that we're pulled apart tonight, i just think of all those people running shoulder and shoulder. this city is lifeless tonight. >> yeah. >> but there will be tomorrow. and we're going to be pulling together as a country. this is a very resilient city. >> yeah. >> as well. and we will pull together and help as much as we can the victims and we're going to make sure the people that did this are brought to justice. >> that's congressman bill keating of massachusetts. i spoke with him just a little bit over an hour ago. to give you an idea of how quickly news is changing and moving still tonight, after these blasts, our discussion there about being unexploded devices found in other places in boston today has since been surpassed by the facts and we're now told to not necessarily be able to say definitively there
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were any other unexploded devices other than the two, well, any explosive devices other than the two that, in fact, exploded. there have been other packages, suspect packages that have been taken care of by law enforcement officials. they were treated as suspected packages. we do not know if they were unexploded bombs at this point. we can't say there were any other unexploded devices found. joining us now is my friend, ron suskind, pulitzer prize winning journalist. on a day when we're thinking about terrorist attacks in the united states, he's the guy you want to talk to. ron is the definitive author of "the american response to terrorism with the 1% dock trip." thanks for being here. >> it's great to be here. >> terms of how america responds to threats, and how america responds to terror, obviously investigation and law enforcement is a huge part of this, but there's more to it, too. >> exactly. it's interesting because the things you can control and things you can't. we're probably not going to be able to stop these sorts of
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attacks. leaving a backpack in a crowded place on a day like this in boston is almost unstoppable. i thing we can control, though, is how we respond. remember, the goal of any bomber, whether it's a lone wolf or group is to create fear, create terror, havoc and to cre havoc and panic. there's been education as to the dialogue the public is having with the people who does these things to us. i think part of it is something, what do the british call, keep calm and carry on. the brits have learned a lot of these lessons. i think we're learning that too. to say, all right, we're not going to change our basic character. the way we handle big public ven events like this. we're going to try to remain true. i think that's challenge now.
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you have the havoc growing across the global news cycles. you're trying to get into the mind of bomber, maybe this is a victory. the capitol is around. the west is locked down. there's fear all over the united states. there's a question of where next. i think these next 24 to 48 hours will be important in terms of leadership and folks in the intelligence and the political actors to say let's take a deep breath, think what happens and we with control how we respond. >> in terms of the way our leaders talk to us about this, but when we're giving instruction, reassurance and given official response from a leaders, is there a new consensus it ought to be about resilience and not about revenge or some other acute response.
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has that changed? >> i think it has. there's balance now. what we do now is important. people are signaling from one another from the podiums to the white house and out in the wide populous as to all right, bad thing happened, horrors have unfolded. >> it's not the first, i won't be the last. >> whatever you say about how this was done, it had some sophistication. it was two bombs that occurred that was not ineffective and the bottom line is that no matter what we do as a society, if we remain a free society, this sort of thing will happen and will happen again. part of what we're learning now is what do we do in response. >> and how do we stay who we are? thank you. it's great to have you here.
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>> be well. >> if you have not read the 1% solution or the way of the world's today is a good day to start. we have more reporting about the b bombing. we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ (vo) purina cat chow. 50 years of feeding great relationships.
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and with responsive, dedicated support, we help you shine every day of the week. i'm rachel maddow. today's boston marathon was in part a memorial to the victims of the mass shooting of the sandy hook victims in december. 26 were killed in the sandy hook killing and the 26th mile was dedicated to the memory of those victims. a teen ran today in their honor. watch. >> reporter: today brought another round of heart ache for a tiny connecticut town that's already suffered so much. the 117th boston marathon was
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dedicated to the memory of the lives lost in the newtown, connectic connecticut mass sheeting. each wave of runners marked 26 seconds before they took off. for some runners it was personal. >> in way it's a bit reliving what we all felt like on that day and the days after. it was pretty horrific. it's hard to wrap your head around the idea that another horrific event occurs while we're trying to commemerate. >> reporter: 26 miles honoring 26 victims. runners in a world famous event that celebrates life remembering the school children and educators who died last december. >> our real role as runners is to be newtown strong. >> reporter: laura was one of a small group of newtown parents
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who took part if the marathon. her fourth grade daughter survived the shooting. >> we know it's nothing like the pain and suffering that the parents are feeling back home. it's running but we want our steps to count. we want them to know we're here and we're not quitting. they're in our hearts. >> reporter: their goal to support a charity called newtown strong raising scholarship money for the siblings of the children who died. >> when we hit boylston street and one that final 3845 yards toward the finish, we're going to sprint like we did that do to get to our children and fly like those kids flew to get to the fire house and let it all out and run for the freedom and for that full on love of life that those kids had.
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>> reporter: the marathon plans were elaborate. there was even a special marker at the 26 mile mark dedicated to the sandy hook victims. in the v.i.p. stands near the end of the run a section set aside for families of the newtown victims and then this. yet another centuriless act of violence rever b rating in place still raw. >> why would anybody do this? they have to find who did this and take them to justice. >> reporter: tonight a report that one 8-year-old boy had died and multiple other children had been injured touched the nerve of a place that's yet to heal. >> it brought back that feeling of making sure that everyone you know is okay. >> reporter: amid the prayers, few may be as heartfelt from thosst